NHL
Greg Wyshynski on When Sharks Will Make Playoffs Again, Why Grier Should Be GM of the Year
This week on the San Jose Hockey Now Podcast, we welcome ESPN senior NHL writer Greg Wyshynski! Greg recently made the case for Mike Grier for GM of the Year, and we had to dive into that, given some of the criticism we’ve heard recently about Grier (48:15).
But before we get to Greg, we start our show with just how important it is that the San Jose Sharks have finished dead-last in the NHL, securing the best odds at the first-overall pick in the 2024 NHL Entry Draft (2:27).
We cover some of the Will Smith ELC signing scenarios (7:40).
Sheng and Keegan discuss some of the San Jose Sharks games this past week, including a shellacking by the Oilers, a win for Devin Cooley, and much more (14:18). We also go into why Danil Gushchin, Jack Thompson, and Georgi Romanov were able to get call-ups this late in the year.
Luke Kunin has been maligned by the analytics folks all year, but Sheng wanted to share some of the league-wide sentiment regarding Kunin’s analytics (23:45).
The San Jose Sharks and Barracuda came out with their 2023-24 awards. Who did Sheng choose for the Sharks/Cuda, and who does Keegan think should have won? (34:30)
Finally, Sheng shares some of his observations from watching Filip Bystedt live. (43:05)
And now, Greg Wyshynski! (48:15)
We recorded this in early April, by the way, before everything happened with the Arizona Coyotes and their move to Salt Lake City.
Greg’s praise for Mike Grier as GM of Year on the Mar. 27 episode of “The Jeff Marek Show” really turned some heads around the NHL (49:00).
So what happens if the San Jose Sharks don’t win No. 1? Would Greg still think of Grier as GM of the Year? (54:20)
Keegan asks the question, what is Sharks’ deserve-o-meter for the No. 1 pick? (57:13)
There’s lots of Arizona Coyotes’ talk here that is outdated…so listen if you want, but understand that the speculation did not end up correct.
Sheng wonders about the national perception of the San Jose Sharks’ rebuild and the Tomas Hertl trade. (1:06:10)
Greg is a famous New Jersey Devils fan, so what does he think of the Timo Meier trade, and Mackenzie Blackwood and Vitek Vanecek in goal? (1:13:35)
How can the San Jose Sharks avoid protracted rebuilds like the Buffalo Sabres and Ottawa Senators are dealing with now, and the Edmonton Oilers dealt with before 2015? (1:19:10)
When does Greg think the Sharks will make the playoffs again? (1:24:15)
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good interview. Though its always better when you interview someone who agrees with me. Especially on the approach to rebuild, we both used the word ‘patience’. On Grier, I think he was also spot on. We both questioned his returns on his trades, we both thought the overall approach of clearing out the big/long contracts was the right strategy. I also agree with the point made about retention spots. The Sharks don’t have much to ‘trade and retain’ at this point anyway. They should have retained more, which goes to the next point. This point deserves scrutiny. Wysh spoke about… Read more »
You could also make the opposite argument, though. Yours assumes that the fastest way to build a contender is through the draft. But that’s not always true. For a team and owner with money, it’s much faster to spend a couple years at the bottom, bank a few high end prospects and then fill in the blanks through free agency and trades. Retaining significant money on Karlsson, and even more so Hertl, would have continued to handicap Grier’s ability to build and shape this roster the way he sees fit. Plattner is not a young man. I doubt he wants… Read more »
Agreed. Retaining more would have been dumb. No way does Grier intend to drag this out for another few years. He’s repeatedly talked about having ammo to trade for players. That means young players who’re NHL ready. Happens every off season and sometimes in season. Like I’ve repeatedly stated, he’s going shopping this off season and this team will not be bottom 10 again unless they get hit with a ton of injuries.
having an additional 4-5 first round picks IS ammo!!
Not just for getting good prospects, but if a Joe Thornton level player hits the market, you’ve got something big to offer up.
That wasn’t going to happen. Maybe a more experienced GM gets a little more but unlikely more 1sts even with retention. Retaining a ton of cap would have been dumb. Getting out of the EK65 contract only retaining 1.5mil was an insane win. Getting that 1st that looks like pick 13 or 14 is a pure cream on top.
I don’t make the argument that the fastest way to a contender is via the draft. I argue its the right way. For example, Wysh says the Sharks are 3 years away from playoffs if they get Celebrini. By that time, Burns and EK65 are off the books. In essence, it makes no difference, except hat got left on the table (high picks). The Sharks are going to be at the low end of cap unless they decide to go big into free agency. Which, as its been said repeatedly, more mistakes get made on the opening day of free… Read more »
The right way is a combination. Every tank team that’s won made trades along the way for core pieces.
draft comes first, additional pieces come next. The Avs, outside of the elite players they drafted, had almost no one they drafted on their Cup winning team.
There’s a lot to do, but the core players are draft picks.
I don’t know if you didn’t read my whole post or are just entrenched in your position, but I addressed all of your points. Once again, you assume this front office and ownership group agrees with your hypothetical timeline. It doesn’t matter when you or Wyshynski think the Sharks will be back in the playoffs. What matters is what Hasso and Grier think, and it’s clear they believe they can turn the ship around faster. In order to do that, they need maximum cap flexibility. Sure, Karlsson and Burns will be off the books in three years. But what if… Read more »
4 more years until playoffs, so potentially 9 years of drought, according to Wysh. For context: Buffalo – 13 year playoff drought Rebuild started in 2013 with Vanek trade, so they’re +11 years since the rebuild began. They might be competitive next year, so we’ll call it 12+ years of rebuild Detroit – 8 year drought Rebuild really started in 2019 with Zetterberg retirement, so they’re in +5 years since the rebuild began. Another bubble year for them next year, so 9+ years out of the playoffs, 6+ years of rebuild Ottawa – 7 year drought Rebuild really started in… Read more »
Its not a short process. It doesn’t always work.There’s more to it than getting top talent. But you rarely get great teams without getting great talent, the type which is mostly found at the top end of the draft. Necessary, but not sufficient. The flip side are the Caps, the Pens, the Avs, the Lightning, the Blackhawks — 10 Cups between them. 15 picks in the top 4 overall between them. Including several who’ll be 1st ballot HOFers. its also not a linear process. The Devils should be good for a long time, but the past 3 seasons are 63pts,… Read more »
I would bet year after next they are a playoff team.
And wrong about when it started for SJ. Rebuild started the moment Grier was hired and he traded Burns.
Getting to the playoffs, in a league where 1/2 the teams make it, isn’t a high bar. Being a genuine contender is and that’s what the Sharks need to build towards.
That is what they’re building towards. You don’t just start making the playoffs and turn instant contender. You start at the outskirts of the playoffs during the rebuild and as pieces come together you eventually turn into a contender if you’ve assembled he right pieces and had some drafting and development luck.
Would you consider the Bruins or Knights to be longtime contenders? You might want to dig into how those winners were built. It’s easy to only use examples that support your point. But there are ways to build a contender without drafting in the top five for four straight years.
I miss Wyshynski on Puck Soup.
Yea, or the old days with marek