NHL
Mario Ferraro Guest Stars + Sharks’ “Hybrid” Rebuild Can Work
Mario Ferraro joins the San Jose Hockey Now Podcast!
Before we get to Ferraro (1:34:49), Keegan and Sheng touch on surprises from the San Jose Sharks’ Rookie Faceoff roster (2:08) and the Pittsburgh Penguins hiring Doug Wilson (8:00).
Then, we look at how post-salary cap era Stanley Cup winners and contenders have been built (11:50). Based on that, Keegan and Sheng believe Mike Grier’s “hybrid rebuild” can work (15:15).
Here’s our snapshot view of every Stanley Cup winner and how they acquired their key players, the 2006 Carolina Hurricanes (19:50), 2007 Anaheim Ducks (23:05), 2008 Detroit Red Wings (26:55), 2009 Penguins (29:45), 2010 Chicago Blackhawks (34:12), 2011 Boston Bruins (39:50), 2012 Los Angeles Kings (42:20), 2013 Blackhawks (46:15), 2014 Kings, 2015 Blackhawks, 2016 Penguins, 2017 Penguins, 2018 Washington Capitals (48:55), 2019 St. Louis Blues (53:24), 2020 Tampa Bay Lightning (55:30), 2021 Lightning, 2022 Colorado Avalanche (59:27), and 2023 Vegas Golden Knights (1:02:00).
It’s worth noting that a number of a high picks like Eric Staal and Drew Doughty and Alexander Ovechkin and Alex Pietrangelo and Steven Stamkos who led their teams to championships weren’t acquired through “tanking”.
Sheng also evaluates how near-Cup winners were built, the 2015/2017 Ducks (1:07:00), 2013/2019 Bruins (1:09:55), 2019/2023 Hurricanes (1:12:30), 2020/2023 Dallas Stars (1:16:47), 2012/2014/2015 New York Rangers (1:20:27), and 2010/2011/2016 San Jose Sharks (1:24:00).
What’s the similarity (1:29:50) between Dean Lombardi and Mike Grier’s rebuild plans?
Keegan and Sheng agree that there are many ways to build a contender. (1:31:20)
Now, it’s Mario! (1:34:49)
We talk first about Ferraro’s new dog, Wilder.
Ferraro talks about hanging out with Joe Thornton in Ontario this summer. (1:37:50)
Ferraro’s Youngest of Plugs YouTube channel has had two episodes in the last two weeks, after a year’s hiatus! (1:38:35)
The San Jose Sharks alternate captain chats about building a relationship with the new guys like Mike Hoffman, Givani Smith, and Leon Gawanke. (1:41:00)
Ferraro talks about his reaction to the Erik Karlsson trade. (1:44:50)
Finally, Mario discusses trying to do too much as a player, which gets you away from what you’re best at on the ice.
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” It’s worth noting that a number of a high picks like Eric Staal and Drew Doughty and Alexander Ovechkin and Alex Pietrangelo and Steven Stamkos who led their teams to championships weren’t acquired through “tanking”. ” Whether acquired by tanking or not, they were drafted by teams that they won the Cup with. These 5 were essential players. Among other essential players drafted top-4 overall by Cup winning teams are Patrick Kane and Jonathan Toews. Tampa also drafted Hedman 2nd overall while the Caps also got Backstrom 4th overall. The Pens got Sid, Malkin and Fleury 1st, 2nd and… Read more »
But in the end, getting top talent is essential — and the worse a team is makes it more likely they get that talent. No one is arguing this. My larger point is, however, that’s not the only way to build a true contender. Both Cup winners and contenders demonstrate that, I think. Also, “the worse a team is makes it more likely they get that talent” doesn’t apply to a number of teams with high picks leading them — the 2007 Ducks, 2008 Wings, 2023 Knights, the Rangers, didn’t acquire their Prongers, Niedermayers, Stuarts, Gaboriks, Eichels & Pietrangelos by… Read more »
I’ll offer a few points. First off, the salary cap didn’t exist until about 2006, so its impact isn’t that great for the 2007 and 2008 teams. Its ‘bite’ became progressively more significant once players needed to re-sign deals. The cap is almost certainly a major factor in the results over the last 15 years. I’ll note teams like the Pens and Avs won titles before elite players (Malkin, Makar) got their first major raise. The Blackhawks gave Kane and Toews massive raises after their Cup win in 2015 — and never seriously competed for a Cup again. I’ve also… Read more »
While I do understand what you’re talking about with being bad unintentionally not technically being a tank. I would say that an unintentional tank should still represent a data point for pro tank. Most of these teams were bad enough they fit the profile of a tanking team, even if they were trying to be competitive the result was the type if talent you get for being really bad. Saying the Pens were not intentionally bad doesn’t change getting Flurry 1rst overall, Malkin 2nd overall, Crosby 1rst overall and Jordan Stahl 2nd overall in 4 straight years. The Blue Jackets… Read more »
I think that is the point of the endeavor. There is a difference between intentionally tanking, say Buf, Edm, Az, chi. (Chi the only quick winner perhaps, Edm took like 7+ years of not trying and getting 1sts to get Mcdavid). Teams may switch to sellers, IE tankers at some point be it injury, or things not going well. But the exercise was about setting out to be bad and ending up being bad, and taking advantage. I think AZ, BuF and even Edm are cautionary tales… but the real lesson is that when you think you will be competitive… Read more »
right but grier turned a franchise player type pick into will smith. He’s good but I don’t think he’s going to be that great, seen lots and lots of players flame out just like him. Dangly, does most of his work in space, dominates weaker competition, luckily his shot is pretty good. The one thing going for him that could set him apart is his tenacity, so hopefully that and a work ethic will get the most out of this pick. Tanking that hard and giving away that many assets for will smith and musty is not a good move,… Read more »
You are however discounting that Timo would have cost more than 9mil he signed for, as well as, that would have made EK65 trading even more difficult. So, it is not just Smith/Musty but Muk and 10 mil in cap for 8 yrs. I did not want Timo to walk but when Hertl was signed and Sharks were bad again, it was inevitable. Yes, DW was really good at squeezing deals, though EK65 deal stands in the face of “elite players for Nothing”. Sharks have a lot of cap space coming and a quality growing prospect pool; have to wait… Read more »
One thing that occurs to me — because the Blue Jackets, indeed, weren’t trying to tank last off-season, if they surprise this year, it could be a blend of adding a top talent in Fantilli along with having good players around him to play with. Good players like Gaudreau that they acquired because they were trying to win.